Fandom Unpacked

From the NBA and Cirque to Iconic Venues: Fandom from Every Angle

• Situation • Season 1 • Episode 17

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How can physical spaces enhance rather than simply contain fan experiences? Kristina Heney, EVP of Marketing at Oak View Group, takes us on a fascinating journey through the evolution of fan-venue relationships, drawing from her remarkable career spanning the NBA, Madison Square Garden, Cirque du Soleil, and now the leader in global venue development.

Heney reveals how next-level fan experiences begin with understanding audience demographics - recognizing that teens camping overnight for their favorite artist have fundamentally different needs than families at afternoon shows or seniors enjoying classic rock concerts. She challenges the industry to raise its baseline expectations, arguing that seamless parking, appropriate food options, and friction-free entry/exit shouldn't be considered "premium" but standard.

The conversation explores how successful venues must reflect and integrate with their local communities through hiring, programming, and architectural decisions. Heney shares surprising insights about fans' willingness to engage more deeply with venues that offer compelling experiences beyond the main event - from member-only speakeasies to post-event celebrations. She advocates for creating "premium for all" experiences rather than just focusing on VIP options.

For marketers and venue operators, Heney offers this profound advice: focus on observing fans throughout their entire venue journey, not just during the show itself. By watching audience behaviors from parking to bathroom lines to concessions, venues gain invaluable insights that drive loyalty and repeat business. Listen now to transform how you think about creating meaningful connections between fans, venues, and the live experiences they share.

Recorded Tuesday, September 23rd, 2025
Hosts: Damian Bazadona, CEO & Founder, Situation & Maureen Andersen, President & CEO, INTIX
Guest: Kristina Heney, EVP Marketing, Oak View Group
Producer: Peter Yagecic, Innovation Advisor, Situation

Peter Yagecic:

You're listening to Fandom Unpacked from Situation and Intix, the podcast series where we unpack modern fandom with some of the brightest minds in sports and entertainment. I'm producer Peter Jicic, and joining me for today's Q&A are Situation CEO and founder, damian Bazzadana, and president and CEO of Intix, maureen Anderson. Our guest today is Christina Heaney, evp of Marketing at Oakview Group, the global leader in venue development, management and premium hospitality services for the live event industry. Here's Damian to get us started.

Damian Bazadona:

Yeah, let's roll, tina. Thank you, as always. Thank you. So, as Peter mentioned, you've had the privilege to work on some of the most iconic brands in live entertainment NBA, msg, cirque, now Oakview Group. You know when you think about fandom and that's a pretty wide range of brands. I just spoke about in different perspectives what would be a through line. You see through all the work that you've done over the years when it comes to understanding fans.

Kristina Heney:

Yeah, thanks, damien, I think you were with me through most of those adventures. So, yes, I've had the good fortune to work with incredibly iconic brands and I've certainly learned each along the way. If I start at the beginning, I started at the NBA at a really unusual time. It was the lockouts. There was a shortened season. We literally didn't have an experience on the courts and yet there was a business because we had fans and there was an unrelenting focus on the fans and community and fostering that relationship because that was the future of the league and that was the future of the NBA's business is how do we represent and have some fidelity to the fans and the fan experience, even when there wasn't an experience on the court?

Kristina Heney:

Next, I had the unbelievable adventure of being at Mass Square Garden for 15 years. Mass Square Garden owns Radio City Music Hall, beacon Theater, a couple of other iconic spots, and there, of course, I continued working with iconic brands, both sports side concerts, but also Radio City, chris Spectacular. But I added the learnings that come from working with iconic venues and the idea that venues can actually enhance an experience. You know Madison Square Garden, the world's most famous arena where artists bring their A-list. You know A-list surprise guests, radio City Music Hall there's no equal, and so working in those spaces really had helped me see how the venue experience itself could enhance the brands.

Kristina Heney:

At Cirque, I widened the perspective of what a brand can look like in different cultures and how it can live with different cultures around the world, and had a really interesting adventure of working with different types of venues at the same time. We worked with everything from the big top that you might be familiar with to casinos, to theaters to arenas all around the world, and the dichotomy of working of what the same brand and the same show and the fan experience was, how that was realized at different venues was pretty eye-opening for me. And now at Oku Group. Oku Group is an owner and operator of our own venues and we innovate at every point of the fan experience and then we share those services with other venue owners around the world. Here we look at how to create those fan experiences through our knowledge of the venue experience itself. So I kind of feel like I've brought it all together with a combination of how iconic brands and venues can pair to create the best experience possible.

Damian Bazadona:

So that is a pretty wide range of live experience experience. I've spent most of my career. I'm in the marketing and advertising space, as you know, and most of my job, where you and I have intersected, is this idea of putting butts in seats right. That's a big part. You've done a masterfully of your entire career, if I may say so. How do you define but now you're a little bit more on the venue side how do you define, like, what is next level fan experience? Like, how do you define your mind? How do you think about that? If I say what's next level fan experience, what does it mean to you and to oakview group yeah, well, I think it starts with uh, what fan are we talking about?

Kristina Heney:

you know our venues can host everything from a family show to a concert that's for tweens, to something where the guests you know the guests are. You know kids and parents, to an older demographic, and it's about meeting the fans where they are. What is the expectation of the fan experience for a more senior audience going to see the Eagles versus a family show audience? And we know, from a marketing perspective, the motivations are different, the target audience psychology is different, but from a venue standpoint it's wildly different as well. Right, are you going to have fans camping out overnight, young fans camping out overnight, young fans camping out overnight? The fan safety changes drastically. What type of food and beverage are you going to serve? Do you care about what the specialty cocktail or whole beer selection is, or are you looking for family-friendly food?

Kristina Heney:

It really spans the gamut and I think the next level is, honestly to me, what the base level should be. The next level is, honestly to me, what the base level should be, which is seamless parking and entry. You know the best choice of food and hospitality based on the target audience, the best show, and you know a seamless exit and back home you go. I think that the next, that, to me, is the base level and I don't think we've achieved even that yet consistently. The next level is probably already here and we just need better adoption of venues like Sphere, intuit, dome, awesome, abba, voyages. They're all at the frontier of using technology to ease friction within the fan experience and also to elevate the actual experience and integrate how the venue enhances the product itself. I think it's about adoption for those and making that scalable to more venues around the world.

Kristina Heney:

And it's coming, it's already started.

Damian Bazadona:

Well, it's fascinating just having two teenage boys, like when I go to a concert event with them. Our definition of a great experience is, I'd say, pretty different. Right Like, you know how fast can we get out of the parking lot? You know, I'm just kidding.

Kristina Heney:

No, but seriously, that people think that shows how far we have to go in the totality of the touch points of a fan experience. It's getting too expensive the actual show or product or game itself that we have to think about over all of those experiences, and it could be good business to do that.

Damian Bazadona:

Yeah, it's fair.

Maureen Andersen:

Yeah, it's that the relationship between fan and venue is so interesting and how it's really kind of morphed and changed in the last you know decade or so, and I mean at lightning speed. You know, I live here in Palm Springs and my home arena is Accusure Arena. Thank you so much. And when I go, the experience that I'm kind of fed up to, what is given to me, is different by what kind of event. So when I go with a senior friend of ours who is a season ticket holder to the Firebirds hockey team, that experience is different than what I'm given when I go to Earth, Wind, Fire or, you know, to Paul McCartney. So that has changed. But the real question is that we still, of course, in that fan venue experience, have a long way to go because, like you said, it's reducing friction. What are we lagging behind on? What are we missing?

Kristina Heney:

in a broad sense, is missing higher level expectations from the fans. Here. Their fans are spending a tremendous amount of money, and more and more every day to see their favorite show, their favorite artist, their favorite team. And yet venues have historically been pretty consistent, 365 days a year, regardless of what's been in the venue itself. And using that brand knowledge, that brand ownership, knowledge of what the fan, you know who the fan is and what do they want and how are they connected to X, y and Z artist or team.

Kristina Heney:

The venue has to use that same knowledge to adapt to their offerings. Is there going to be a lot of people driving or are folks going to take public transit? Are there going to be a lot of people driving or are folks going to take public transit? Are there going to be a lot of Uber drop-offs? All of those things should be thought of just from every touchpoint along the fan experience. It should be curated to the audience in the building.

Kristina Heney:

And I think 10 years ago the innovation was VIP right, where guests who had more money could have the best parking spots, could cut the line, for you know that's otherwise seen as inconvenient, could maybe have a special club to hang out in and you know and have special seats, but now what many venues are considering and what OBG is trying to do is to say no, no, no. It should be where every fan experience has less friction and has more curated offerings and there should be a sense of premium for all, where, whether or not you want a membership-only speakeasy experience and you want to come early and have that and stay late and have a post-party, or you want a great hot dog and you know a cold beer and cold draft beer, those two experiences can exist and should, and it's good business for venues to start curating their experiences for the guests in the building on any given night or day, great ideas, curating the experience for every fan.

Maureen Andersen:

And you know it is different and every human being and I'm different, as a customer as well, to what the event and who I'm with and and time of day and time of year and all kinds of things that go into that as well, and you know, always give me good food and always give me, you know, a private bathroom and parking. Um, that's my curation. Um, I am curious also is that you know, when you work with Cirque and Madison Square Gardens, these are big, storied venues with decades worth of story and history that you know to tell and that comes kind of a package storytelling. It makes it easier. The platform is already there. Oakview Group has, you know, so many new buildings coming into market and you know Akershire and Co-op and Moody and Climate Pledge. How do you bring a new narrative or a new mindset to sports venue and marketing when you're starting at ground zero with a story? How do you evolve that?

Kristina Heney:

It's all about the community. You know, every community we enter has its own characteristics, its own personality, its own traditions, its own, you know, sustainability challenges, its own diversity, and how we reflect and how, as any venue whether or not we can build it from scratch or we operate it on behalf of others how we approach that has to be, um, in keeping with the, the community, right. So, because it is oftentimes a gathering place, uh, and hopefully a happy gathering place of the of the community and and therefore it should reflect it. So that's where we start, and you'll see us working with local sponsors. We'll have naming contests for various teams, et cetera, like we did for Climate Pledge Arena and the Seattle Cracking, and all of those are ways to integrate and build those stories. And then, honestly, we build a venue story, but we also have an obligation to partner with the brand owners to make sure that we're building a fan experience around their brand as well.

Maureen Andersen:

I want to take that one step further and then I'll put this back over to Peter, but I was curious. Is that when we were talking prior, is that you talked about the empathy for the fans and it is when you're in a community, is that you're reflecting what that community looks like, so the diversity and looking for ways for inclusion, and that there's there's rooted presence inside of of a community, and I see that here in my own with the iceplex and kids and pride fest and parades and you know, is that part of the of the, the focus and the organicness of of Oakview Group.

Kristina Heney:

Now, it absolutely is. It's a core principle of ours that everything about our venue should reflect the community in which we service. So it starts with the building itself feeling organic to the community if we have the opportunity to build or refurbish or renovate, or renovate. But it starts with hiring the folks who you are seeing in the building should reflect the content that we're going to have available, as well as the audience we're serving. The content itself, what content we're bringing to the venue. Obviously it's good business to be able to sell tickets back to Damien and my roots, but then also how we're thinking about being a citizen of the community, and Cirque really taught me that, even though we were transient in terms of traveling around the world, live experiences are served so hyper-locally and so personally. They could be global brands, but they're experienced in venues of all sizes around the world and there's no replicating that. And how we engaged in each of those communities was um was, I think, the key to to circ's success and, and hopefully, the keto groups as well it's up to you.

Maureen Andersen:

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Peter Yagecic:

I'm going to try to sneak in a couple of audience questions here real quick and then I will pitch it back to our hosts. This first one I couldn't resist, because you've all mentioned parking to some extent in today's conversation already. I saw a video not long ago about how AI robots are being used to park cars in China. Has Oakview Group been talking to any robotics companies to explore bringing that stateside?

Kristina Heney:

AI robotics for parking Wow, that I hadn't heard. No-transcript, first friction points. But I would say it doesn't have to be high tech. My favorite story about parking is Disney, where they employ folks to guest experienced folks to help you find your car after a long day at the park, whether it's after fireworks or whatever it is. It's been a long day. You've been there walking around all day. They've got your money.

Kristina Heney:

That you've already experienced at the park and here they are spending time making sure that you can find your car and get on your way safely and without any more friction. And they do that just by timestamping, where they're filling the parking lots at any given time. So they can say to you Peter, well, no problem, we'll help you out. About what time did you park today? Oh, I got here at 820 for road drop or whatever, and then they know exactly where you parked. That was simple, it was just tracking.

Kristina Heney:

A little Excel chart could do that. That was simple, it was just tracking. A little Excel chart could do that. And I think that speaks back to Maureen's comment about empathy, if you think throughout the fan experience, of all of the potential points where the fan could have friction or the fan could have an opportunity for optimized experience and recognize that each step along that way is a part of your responsibility, then I think you make those decisions and you can solve for it in simple or you can go for the AI robots Little from column A, little from column B and I do need that empathy because I never remember to take the picture of the sign where I'm parked at One more fan question, audience question that I want to squeeze in this one's a little bit bigger picture.

Peter Yagecic:

But what is something that's crucially important to fans, that has surprised you in the work that you do with venues or logistics, is anything that sticks out that you were like oh wow, we didn't expect that.

Kristina Heney:

I don't think it's so much what I've learned that they expect. It's actually what I've learned that you can earn by surprising them, and that they are ready to engage in venues more and ready to engage in a broader experience if you offer something compelling. We've all had the experience where we've been meeting friends for a concert and we've said, okay, well, where should we have? Where should we? What bar, what restaurant should we meet up at before? Right, no one is thinking we should have a great early night dinner at the arena. Right, that's not. That hasn't really become something expected of clients. But if you offer it, if you offer a member-only speakeasy, like we have in Moody Center or the Rah-Rah Room, like Phoenix has, or an opportunity to party afterwards, like so literally to take the party into the atrium at Co-op Live, you recognize that people will stay and continue to engage with it. And you have these opportunities, step by step, to broaden the fan experience, to broaden how they engage with the wider experience of a show or a game. If you give them that option.

Kristina Heney:

And I think that's the biggest takeaway I've had that a lot of our innovations have just come from looking around the corner and saying, hey, why do we have to settle for a bad glass of wine. Why can't we offer a great glass of wine? Why can't we offer multiple types of draft beer? And, I think, why can't we offer the best hot dog? Why can't we offer a best hot dog? Why can't we offer, you know, a member, only dining experiences? And when we do do that, it's folks engage and, and I think that's the, that's the biggest learning, necessarily, that I've had at ok group, um, and I'm looking, I'm looking forward to seeing what's next, because sky's the limit when you think, when you take that perspective, yeah, what's the? How do you think what's next? Because sky's the limit when you take that perspective.

Damian Bazadona:

Yeah, what's the how do you think, what's the secret I guess I don't know if you'd say a secret or what's the recipe, I think, for making a venue itself like a destination for fandom. And how do you think about measuring success? Now, I recognize this is not a lazy question where it's like well, how do you measure success? I find it probably complicated because, particularly on some things people might expect like people, it's all an expectations game of what their expectations are going in. So I'm just curious how you think about how you measure. Are we being effective at what we're trying to do?

Kristina Heney:

Well, I don't think anyone's nailed it, but I do think you know, from our perspective, the question I want to win every given, I want to win every time it's asked is where will I have the best experience? And that's agents and bookers thinking about where they're going to route their artists to fans saying, if I have a choice of where to see my favorite artist or obviously less choice when it comes to teams is, um, I will go here. We had that at the garden because people, we had this aura that folks were going to bring their a game to the garden and and they were going to bring their a list you know, surprise guests and there was going to be something special. That happens at the garden. But for other venues around the world it can be as easy as where's the best food? Where is there no problem with parking? All of the things we've talked about. If you put them together, they create a better experience and we want to win that argument every time.

Kristina Heney:

What's the best experience? And from KPIs, it can be everything from nps scores. At circ we had, um, the nps score for the show or the game. Well, in the case, the show, uh, but we also had the cx nps. So what were the friction points or the best attributes of the fan experience outside of the big top? And so we measured that from and obviously they they, you know vary widely between a big top that was literally popped up in the middle of nowhere to, uh, an arena or an established theater or something like that. But we also can look at the numbers right.

Kristina Heney:

Where is your per cap increasing because you've offered a different variety of whatever? Where's your um? What's the feedback from the artists that they're comfortable and their teams are comfortable staying at your venues? We actually spend a ton of time and effort on the backstage experience that fans never see. So we have artist compounds where they can hang out with their family. We've got workout rooms. We have all of this backstage stage at more and more venues that um, so that we can entice the artists to feel comfortable staying at, staying and performing at our venues. So it's it's a holistic view of it and it's not perfect definitely a science in the art.

Damian Bazadona:

But if you focus on winning that question every time, I think you'll be headed in the right direction yeah, no, it's interesting, your note, just like you sort of said, no one's figured it out in the sense of like it's complicated, it's extremely complicated. Yeah, maureen.

Maureen Andersen:

Hey, I'm very interested in you know so many venues is that you know the ticket itself is the key that unlocks to. You know who that person is, and behind all of that is this huge, vast amount of data that you have access to about the person and what their preferences and stuff are. Are there innovations, either digitally or physically, inside the venue or the event space, that you're excited about you know? For example, is you know, are there more kiosk kind of things? Can I walk up to a kiosk and, you know, insert my credit card and get a bottle of Domaine Chandon, you know, and just take it away without having to go through? You know a maze of people, or talk to anybody, or you know grab and go. I know all that stuff is pretty established stuff, but is there something that's new and exciting about engaging digitally or physically with them, with the data especially?

Kristina Heney:

Absolutely. I mean, I mean first party data has been the holy grail for decades and live entertainment, uh, has the amazing good fortune of of having always had first party data through the ticketing process. And you know we've always said for with data comes responsibility, and if and we've always believed, at least in my teams, that if we had the data, it was our responsibility to act with it, to act with empathy, to figure out how we can improve the experience for that guest. And that absolutely should translate into the venue experience and reducing friction. And the most notable example is Intuit Dome, where your ticket is connected to an app and they use facial recognition to smooth the lines at entry.

Kristina Heney:

You can walk into a kiosk where you can get your bottle of Dom Perignon. Maybe I'd have to check the branding and the sponsorship at Intuit Dome, but you can at our venues and you can just walk through using your face as your ID and what does it do? It gets you what you want with less friction and back to your seat as fast as you can to enjoy the experience you paid for. So I think the key there is adoption and with any new technology, it's getting folks used to using it and then you know getting it scalable right. So how more and more venues can adopt similar technology, so that that becomes the norm.

Maureen Andersen:

Well, and that brings up the really great question is that you have venues that are servicing millions of fans a year around the globe. Is that? How do you balance that personalization and scale? I mean, does AI? Is that figuring into what's going to be happening?

Kristina Heney:

definitely data plays a massive role. Machine learning AI has been used extensively, but I would say, simplest.

Maureen Andersen:

Without the huge investment of data in AI, it starts with one fan at a time and one community at a time In one venue and one you know, and if the event is right and the experience is right, I love that one sound Down to one person. Thank you, Yep. That's how you win. I love that one sound Down to one person. Thank you, Yep. That's how you win. I'll give it back to Peter for some questions.

Peter Yagecic:

Yeah, I want to try to squeeze in two more quick audience questions, which I think this one is slightly relevant to where you guys were just talking. Earlier you talked a little bit about your work with Cirque du Soleil and international audiences. How are international fans different from US fans and how are they the same? And I wonder if it kind of connects to that technology? Is there a translation expectation or is there anything around international audiences that you've discovered?

Kristina Heney:

audiences that you've discovered. Yeah, absolutely. This is one of my favorite discoveries of working with Cirque du Soleil that this one iconic brand could be translated differently in multiple cultures. And that's what it is. It's that the fan is bringing their culture to the experience and that's what makes it different and that's what makes it unique. All of their fans and traditions and cultural references are so different. In mexico, where people bring, you know, where their average ticket is like five or six per order, because they want to come with a family, they want to come with multiple generations, versus uk, where we might play it, you know, at a royal albert hall, where it's you know, they're looking for a facade, a show, this epic, whereas in China, for example, they're looking for huge and larger-than-life and high-technology uses. The fan is bringing something different to the brand, but the brand is the same and I think that was pretty fascinating for me. I also think, well, cirque was a bit different in that I called their language Cirque-ish, because literally, the Cirque show was created to be borderless and to travel across borders around the world seamlessly, and that's why the language is sort of a mishmash, and so it works really well for that.

Kristina Heney:

But I think that the most recent example is Taylor Swift. I mean I loved listening to. Well, first there was the dancer that would always have a different saying and there was a different translation for a line. We're never getting back together, right, everyone on the screen knows what I'm talking about, but there was that one line where they would articulate different based on the culture and the language they were in. But there was also the experiences that the culture brought to. Like Argentina versus Australia versus the UK. It was wildly different in terms of what the fans brought and how they incorporated their culture into the same concert that was touring the world, and I think that I mean that's why Taylor was so brilliant, right, she recognized that and embraced it, and I think that's what more and more brands around the world will do as brands go global.

Peter Yagecic:

What can't we learn from Taylor Swift? That's my motto. Hey, seriously, last audience question and then I'll kick it back to Damien. The conversation around next-level fan experiences has made me think about how airports have tried to up their game when it comes to the flyer experience. Can entertainment learn from venues like, say, the new LaGuardia, or vice versa?

Kristina Heney:

Yeah, I mean, I am not ashamed to say that I will eat at the United Club at Newark Airport now, which I don't think I ever, ever, ever would have said. I know folks who love the hotel experience at JFK, you know. So it was Terminal 5, right. So, yes, I've always been a big believer in live entertainment, benchmarking their learnings against other industries that are doing something better. Damien and I always talk about that when it about digital and use of behavioral insights to drive digital adoption and efficacy. But I would also say venues themselves can look at non-traditional live entertainment to find learnings. Golf, live golf. We were talking about some Savannah Bananas in our prep F1. They are festivals. In our prep um f1. They are festivals.

Kristina Heney:

These are all non-traditional entertainment options in non-traditional venues that are creating unbelievable experiences that are almost, you know, agnostics of whether or not there's walls, uh, and an actual building itself, and what you can learn from that.

Kristina Heney:

What we've been learning from that at Opie Group is pretty eye-opening how you can think about the experience starting outside the walls and what does a premium experience for all look like? It spans the gamut and there's a lot of opportunity there as well, in addition to LaGuardia Maybe not LaGuardia yet. But I think the other point that I would make is that you also, the tipping point is when travelers or fans you know, who have visited multiple airports or venues, start recognizing when choice is not available and quality is not available. And then the expectation game is raised. And I think we're seeing that at airports, thankfully for folks who travel as much as I do, but now we're also starting to see it at venues, and maybe we have for the last couple years, and that's a real opportunity when fans start saying no, I do want more for my experience, my dollar, yeah and I.

Peter Yagecic:

I love that you mentioned the savannah bananas. We have emily cole who's going to be joining us in December December 9th on a fandom unpacked, so we'll be sending out information on that, but, damian, I want to I am a part of her fandom. Me too, Damian. I want to kick it back to you for our last question.

Damian Bazadona:

Yes, I got last question, so let me, before I ask the last question, I just want to say Tina, thank. I really believe you have an extremely unique perspective of all these years and watching the work you do and how you do it masterfully not just blowing smoke, truly and you're always willing to share your wisdom and I genuinely appreciate it. You've got a lot going on over there. I can tell We've had a blast, yes, so what is something as the folks listening in, we've got people from from all walks of life of live entertainment. Our whole job is engaging fans and engaging audiences. What's something you think marketers or producers of content, whatever it might be, most often misunderstand about live audiences today that you maybe consistently see happening over and over again, that you might, you know, share your wisdom on?

Kristina Heney:

This is what I say to young marketers or marketers starting out in live entertainment specifically. Because live entertainment is so personal and visceral, there's a risk that marketers could focus on the show or the game, and what I tell them is don't focus on the show or the game, focus on the fans. Watch the fans. They will tell you everything you need to know about if you're winning in the game of fan experience and how you're going to create repeat and loyalty and drive that, and don't just sit in the seats. Walk outside and see what the experience is in the parking area and on the line to get in. Stand at the bathroom and see if there are bathroom lines.

Kristina Heney:

How long is it taking someone to get back to their seats, to get a bottle of water or something to eat? All of those things are the responsibility of a marketer and a live experience. And because live entertainment is so visceral and personal, you could really make the mistake of thinking your experience or your view of the product or the artist or whatever is that of the masses, and in actuality, it could be the other way around. So I think that's usually my feedback Watch the fans.

Peter Yagecic:

That's going to do it for this episode of Fandom Unpacked the podcast. If you liked what you heard, please be sure to leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. Find out how to join us live for an upcoming recording at SituationLivecom slash fan. We'll see you next time, true believers.